fediverse (@fediverse@app.wafrn.net)
TL;DR: they took a different approach to decentralization, and blew up too quickly. There's a technical challenge or two in the way, and they didn't have time to solve it.
What follows is a probably-too-long explanation of the entire situation.
Ok so if you think of "a social media app" as a big cake, with "input from users" at the bottom and "output from your screen" at the top, ActivityPub/Fedi is basically a bunch of individual towers with bridges between them. Each tower has its own input and output stream, and they talk to each other through the bridges. Each tower can be completely different as long as the bridges make sense.
ATProto takes the perpendicular approach of splitting each layer of the cake, with the seam between each layer being made as generic as possible.
The reality is a little more complex, but for the most generic ATProto view, there's 4 layers:
- the PDS, which stores the data created by the user. Count: many independent ones, single-user instances relatively common
- the relay, which groups events created by many PDSes into a single "firehose". Count: a few tens, I believe
- the AppView, which consumes the firehose and turns that into a crystallized, easy-to-lookup index. The actual "backend" of your app. Count: for microblogging specifically, basically just BlueSky itself.
- the client, which is the webapp that talks to the AppView. Count: five or so, but it's really easy to selfhost. There's just not that much point.
What makes Bluesky "actually" centralized?
The AppView. Everything else is proven in reality to be decentralized and hostable by small groups or individuals.
Why?
It's the workhorse of the app, so it has to deal with every interaction, every reply and post, stitch it all into a fast database, and maintain that state. This is roughly as complicated as just running Twitter. So you need to be big.
Can you distribute the work?
https://tangled.sh does this. It's pretty cool! It's not really feasible for Bluesky, afaik: it's too global, too fast.
Can you split the app and keep interop, like ActivityPub?
Yes, but only by sacrificing something: global search & accurate interactions, data control, "forever" history of interactions…
Can Bluesky become fully decentralized-for-real in the same way as ActivityPub?
Technically? Yes, by sacrificing something. There just hasn't been a real attempt at balancing the sacrifices.
Socially? Probably not. You'd need a new app, or you'd still have one instance with millions of users.
Why is Bluesky like this?
Two reasons: they chose a different set of tradeoffs, and they grew too quickly.
They chose data portability and global consistencs over a flexible and resilient global network, and they didn't have time to sand off the edges by the time the election rolled around.
#atproto #fedi #activitypub #ramblings
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blainsmith (@blainsmith@snac.rblgk.sh)
The 2 relays I connected my instance to have been working out nicely!
#ActivityPub
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reiver (@reiver@mastodon.social)
If we were to do a regular online Fediverse meeting —
(Maybe once a month.)
WHAT DAYS OF THE WEEK WOULD YOU BE ABLE TO ATTEND?
A regular (online) meeting for Fediverse developers, for those who care about the Fediverse as a social movement, and for those who care about the success of the Fediverse.
Sunday?
Monday?
Tuesday?
Wednesday?
Thursday?
Friday?
Saturday?
(You can pick more than one day)
PLEASE REPLY WITH YOUR ANSWER.
#ActivityPub #FediDev #FediUX #Fediverse #FediverseUX #SocialWeb
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fedizen (@fedizen@mastodon.social)
»The Case for Alien Life on Saturn’s Moon Just Got a Boost« https://www.404media.co/the-case-for-alien-life-on-saturns-moon-just-got-a-boost-2/?Fedizen.EU #Fedizen #Fediverse #ActivityPub #News
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uschleth (@uschleth@mastodon.social)
@selbstreferent ich als #diaspora nutzer hätt mich auch besser mit dem fediday identifizieren können und wär vielleicht sogar gekommen, wenn mir das alles nicht so #activitypub - zentristisch vorkäme.
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w (@w@fair.tube)
2. Berlin Fediday - Rooftop Stage - 10/4/2025, 1:01:41 PM
https://fair.tube/w/wAwDyv8QsHPJLYHqFCpEoG
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akenyg (@akenyg@mastodon.social)
Tack @carl som fortsätter påminna oss om att plattformarnas tid förhoppningsvis snart är över. Istället för #plattform borde vi i den demokratibärande sektorn tänka #protokoll Agera proaktivt istället för att bara reagera på #BigTech 's dikeskörningar.
De alternativa tekniska lösningarna som kan garantera inkludering, rättvisa och ett fungerande demokratiskt torg finns ju redan. Så vad väntar vi i det offentliga Sverige på?
https://carlheath.se/fran-digitala-tivolin-till-demokratiska-allmanningar/
#ActivityPub #ATprotocol #mastodon #bluesky
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box464 (@box464@mastodon.social)
RE: https://spark.box464.social/pub/objects/01K6QYSXP3QJKFM8Y8CH92G1SF
Bonfire pushed a big release last week, and I'm excited to try out all the new shiny things on my test instance.
Post migration and Quote Posts among them.
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kevinveenbirkenbach (@kevinveenbirkenbach@microblog.infinito.nexus)
If you want to try the different #Fediverse #Applications like @peertube @pixelfed @Mastodon @bookwyrm @funkwhale @mobilizon etc., but you're to lazy to click an account for each applications, checkout https://infinito.nexus . With #SSO you have one Login to "rule them all" ;)
You can also use #InfinitoNexus to setup your whole #ActivityPub #ITInfrastructure #OnPremise(as long as you use it #nonprofit).Just download https://s.infinito.nexus/code and run the #ansible script.
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JohannesStarke (@JohannesStarke@norden.social)
Jetzt hab ich einen kleinen Fan-Moment auf dem #FediDay. @pfefferle und seinem #ActivityPub Plugin für #Wordpress verdanken wir einiges.
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dansup (@dansup@mastodon.social)
The fediverse needs better developer resources. The kind ATProto has.
Fixing that gap: rich documentation, interactive examples, instant prototyping.
Built indie-style with FediDB, browser.pub and other community resources to create a better foundation for the next generation of fediverse developers.
Sometimes one spark is all it takes. Share if you care ✨
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kevinveenbirkenbach (@kevinveenbirkenbach@microblog.infinito.nexus)
Hopefully learning now how #ATProtocol works exactly during the talk of @cwebber and what are the (dis)advantages of #Bluesky vs. #Mastodon on the #Fediday / @berlinfediday #Berlin. #Bluesky and @Mastodon are part of the #InfitoNexus #Framework but I actually prefer the #federated approach of #ActivityPub platforms.
You can click an account for both solution types and check out the integration here:
https://s.infinito.nexus/mastodon, https://s.infinito.nexus/mastodoncode
https://s.infinito.nexus/bluesky
https://s.infinito.nexus/blueskydemo
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